Looking to Replace my PTZ camera with a newer model

[Parley]

My Dahua SD5A425XA PTZ is starting to pale compared to my other cameras. So, I am looking for an upgrade. I do not want a huge PTZ in the front of my house. I was looking at the Dahua PTZ's and nothing really jumped out at me. However, I ran across this Hikvision 8MP PTZ with a 1/1.8" sensor and what jumped out at me was the 0.0005 Lux rating. That is very good for an 8MP on a 1/1.8" sensor. Normally I would just move right along. It is the same as the 4MP version in the same camera. I checked a few sources to see if that is true and they all had the same numbers. I would be interested in your input. Here is a link to the Hikvision PTZ.

Edit: I will take a nighttime picture and post it.

DS-2DE7A812MCG-EB

Hikvision 7-inch 8 MP 12X ColorVu Network Speed Dome DS-2DE7A812MCG-EB

www.hikvision.com

 

[bigredfish]

I don’t know anything about that PTZ but I know that having compared cameras in the past there’s not been a direct relationship between HiK and Dahua with respect to their min illumination numbers.

 

[wittaj]

Many do not pay attention to the minimum illumination specs...because those are under ideal situations with so many factors not known.

Almost every camera will say 0 LUX with infrared or white LED on, and we all know how poorly Reolinks perform at night in low light yet that is their spec....or even two different good cameras. Take for example the 5442 4MP2.8mm fixed lens camera will beat the socks off the 5241 2MP 2.8mm fixed lens or a Reolink and they both say 0 Lux with IR on.

Heck darn near every camera will say 0 LUX with IR on....

Once upon a time manufacturers would at least say at what shutter speed that rating was based on. Most would say a 1/3 shutter. That is way to slow for anything. You need to run minimum 1/60 shutter to start to minimize blur.

But now they don't even provide that, so in most cases it is a wide open iris, slowest shutter the camera allows, and gain and brightness cranked to 100 so that they can get the lowest illumination number possible.

But nobody would run the camera in that configuration.

Some of the older cameras would give these kind of specs so you knew how the camera was setup to come up with the minimum illumination.

0.002Lux/F1.5 ( Color,1/3s,30IRE)
0.020Lux/F1.5 ( Color,1/30s,30IRE)
0Lux/F1.5 (IR on)

So of course, the faster the shutter, the more light that is needed, and thus the LUX needed is more. It would be nice if they still provided it in this manner.

To minimize blur with motion, you need to run a shutter at at least 1/60 shutter - once you start doing that, the LUX specs are out the window.

But as more competition came out, manufacturers started playing games and tweaking the settings for getting the lowest lux possible, but that came at a cost of a configuration nobody would use. So they wouldn't say how the camera was configured to capture that minimum illumination rating.

They play these marketing games to make it look like the camera is better than it is for someone that is just chasing minimum illumination numbers. Kind of like how we rarely get the miles per gallon a car is rated for.

It is a tool, but I would prefer to see the reviews here with settings provided and make an educated guess as to if my light is more or less than the reviewer.

 

[Parley]

I agree. That is normally why I would not give the time of day to a 4k camera on a 1/1.8" sensor. B&H Photo had this used camera on sale at a little over 1/2 price and that is why I took a peek at the specs and saw the Lux numbers.

 

[33696933]

Its different because this one has a much larger lens/aperture than normal and probably why the optical zoom is only at 12x because that lens is eating up the space. Looks interesting though at least

 

[Parley]

Its different because this one has a much larger lens/aperture than normal and probably why the optical zoom is only at 12x because that lens is eating up the space. Looks interesting though at least

I was wondering if that might be the case. The 12X would be just fine where I would be putting it. Hmmmm. Thank you for your input.

 

[33696933]

I was wondering if that might be the case. The 12X would be just fine where I would be putting it. Hmmmm. Thank you for your input.

If the stock photo is real it does appear quite a large lens compared to my tandemvu in the same body. The blacked out part of the glass lens is much smaller on this one compared to mine. These bodies a bit larger than the SD5 too

 

[Parley]

Here is a picture taken at 2am this morning with the current Dahua PTZ. There is plenty of ambient light available, so maybe the 4k Hikvision PTZ with the 1/1.8" sensor may actually work in this location. I am thinking real hard about this one.

 

[Parley]

Well, with all that is going on with China and Andy's post of a couple of minutes ago, I just placed the order for the Hikvision DS-2DE7A8112MCG-EB. That is the 4k model. I am not taking any chances. I was going to wait awhile, but I decided to act now. It is supposed to arrive a week from Monday. I am going to make a custom metal mounting bracket for it and replace the current wooden one.

 

[Parley]

I just ordered a 24VAC power supply for this particular Hikvision PTZ. Fortunately, they are not expensive. This PTZ uses 42W with everything turned on, so I got a 50W power supply.

 

[triumph202]

I just placed the order for the Hikvision DS-2DE7A8112MCG-EB

Hi Parley, I've been thinking about getting a PTZ - who did you buy it through? Any reason for switching to Hikvision and not going with Dahua again?

 

[Parley]

Hi Parley, I've been thinking about getting a PTZ - who did you buy it through? Any reason for switching to Hikvision and not going with Dahua again?

I bought it through B & H Photo based in New York City. I liked the performance of the Hikvision over the Dahau. Dahua seems to have stopped selling some of their PTZ's. Normally I would not buy a 4K camera with a 1/1.8" sensor, but this one looks like it might an exception to the rule. Also, I have plenty of ambient night light in the front of the house. I would be afraid to put it in the back of my house which is a lot darker.

 

[triumph202]

I bought it through B & H Photo based in New York City...

Okay, thanks. I'd like that camera, but the size probably makes it a bit to conspicuous. It's very abnormal for people in Australia to have cameras like that on their houses- the neighbours will think I'm dealing or something!

Do you have a Hikvision NVR also (from memory)? If you have (and are still using one), how does the Dahua PTZ work with the Hik NVR? Do you get alerts through okay on the timeline? I swapped from a 7608NI-I2 to a 7616NI-M2 and am regretting it a bit due to their woeful software.

 

[Parley]

Okay, thanks. I'd like that camera, but the size probably makes it a bit to conspicuous. It's very abnormal for people in Australia to have cameras like that on their houses- the neighbours will think I'm dealing or something!

Do you have a Hikvision NVR also (from memory)? If you have (and are still using one), how does the Dahua PTZ work with the Hik NVR? Do you get alerts through okay on the timeline? I swapped from a 7608NI-I2 to a 7616NI-M2 and am regretting it a bit due to their woeful software.

Yes, I have Hikvision NVR's. No problem with Dahua cameras. You just have to click on ONVIF.

 

[Parley]

By the way, this is how Hikvision explains the very good LUX numbers for this model. It is as some have said. It is indeed because of the newer style lens.

"The new PTZ cameras' fixed F1.2 lens aperture allows as much as 14x more light to enter the lens compared to conventional PTZ units. This same capability also ensures vivid and full-color imaging in light conditions as low as 0.0005 lux: or nearly total darkness. The result is bright and colored images, even in extremely low light conditions or at night."

On a side note, as to the power. If your POE cable is not up to the task than you have to use 24VAC and the power plug. I have CAT 6 cable with 23-gauge solid copper wire, so that should work. Also, the length is only around 50'. This camera uses 42 watts with everything turned on, and I am going to use a Trendnet POE +++ 60W power injection unit.

 

[triumph202]

So they're claiming the lens is f1.2 over it's full magnification range? Most spec sheets give the aperture opening range for the lens full magnification range- but they've only listed it as "Maximum f1.2" for that model.

It will be interesting to see what you find in real world testing.

 

[Parley]

The Hikvision PTZ camera came in yesterday, and I set it up in my garage today. Out of the box it was far from being ready to go. The Hikvision setup is a little different than the Dahua. I was getting nervous in that I might have to send the camera back. However, in the end I won the battle. The picture is clearer than the Dahua it will replace. We shall see if it has enough zoom. One of the problems I had was the tilt control. At first it would only go up to even or straight out. There are like 15 settings for this. I finally found the right one. It was the last one on the list. Another one was the zoom. There are a number of settings for that. Again, I finally found the setting that allowed me to zoon all the way out. Also, this camera was not focusing right and there was a lot of "noise". It took me awhile, but I finally got that taken care of.

Last but not least, there is supposed to be a clear covering over the lens that you have to remove. Mine did not have one. Also, some very minor marks on the wall mount. I have to wonder if this camera was used and that is why the settings were so screwed up out of the box. One more thing is that this camera does come with a 60 Watt POE power supply. I did not see that mentioned anywhere. Also, I am using the POE power wires that are in the Cat 6 cable, and that seems to be working fine. It may be a week or so before I mount it. I am waiting for the metal parts to come in for my home-made outdoor mounting bracket.

 

[triumph202]

I have to wonder if this camera was used and that is why the settings were so screwed up out of the box.

Were the factory seals intact on the box?

 

[Parley]

Were the factory seals intact on the box?

Good point. I just do not remember if I cut the seal or if it was already cut. I remember cutting open the bigger box with my pocket knife.

 

[Parley]

I mounted the Hikvision PTZ today. A couple of neighbors helped me with the project. One did the welding on the bracket that I had to make up. The other helped me mount it. The camera was a little awkward to mount and for safety reasons I felt that I needed another hand. Plus, he has an extension ladder. The picture looks good. I like how the colors look real. By the way with this 4K PTZ, I now have all 4K cameras except the Dahua S3 varifocals. I took two pictures today. One of the street view from the camera and another of how it is mounted. Here is the mounting picture and the camera picture.