Challenging camera use case, Is it possible under $1,000

[oldspyguy]

The objective is to monitor a mailbox with enough detail to identify the vehicle as it stops and drives away. The challenge is the camera is 300’ away from the target area. I have been using a Reolink 811A 4K with 5x zoom but as we know their image quality is not applicable to this type of application. I have had better luck with the Hikvision clone with the same specs but realize I am asking too much from a camera with that field of view.


Below is the raw image from the 811A with the zoom maxed out and below that the image digitaly zoomed.



I probably need a 50mm lens to get the detail and would need two cameras to cover the target area which is fine. They are camouflaged in a stand of trees so size is a concern. I tried the best Reolink PTZ with 16x zoom but the image was disappointing and it was to large. A box camera will most likely be the choice.
The cameras are in the treeline 300’ from the road powered by a poe++ switch and wireless bridge 400’ back to the house. I would rather not bury cable out to a closer point as it might be noticed. I am open to any suggestions at this point.

So, does anyone have a camera suggestion that might work for this application under $1,000?
Thank you for any suggestions you may have.

 

[wittaj]

Yeah a Reolink will never give you that.

The distance isn't a challenge. It is all the trees that will make it tough to get a clean image at night as they will absorb and bounce around most of the IR.

But for a clear daytime you need the 52IR-Z12E or a real PTZ not a toy Reolink.

EmpireTech IPC-B52IR-Z12E-S2 1/2.8" CMOS 2MP 5mm–60mm Ultra Low Light

2MP 1/2.8" CMOS image sensor Built-in IR LED, the max. illumination distance is 150 m Deep learning algorithm Built-in MIC IP67 and IK10 protection SMD 3.0

empiretech01.com

EmpireTech PTZ5A4M-25X 1/1.8" CMOS 4MP 25x Starlight IR 5.4mm–135mm Va

4MP, 1/1.8" CMOS Powerful 25x optical zoom Starlight+ Technology Max. 25/30fps@4MP IR distance up to 150 m Deep-learning-based perimeter protection Auto-tracking and IVS PoE+ IP67, IK10

empiretech01.com

 

[bigredfish]

One option might be the Triplesight

IPC-MFW5241T2-E3-ASE - Dahua International

IPC-MFW5241T2-E3-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Dahua IPC Perimeter Protection Camera - Dahua International

Dahua IPC Perimeter Protection Camera

www.dahuasecurity.com

3 views in one.
Channel 1: 3.6 mm
Channel 2: 12 mm
Channel 3: 25 mm

The downside:

• Daytime, fine. But like any camera you'll need light at the target at night. 300ft is a long way for IR without moving up to a PTZ
• Its only 2MP so not high res as we think of it today

Otherwise, the 5442 Z-12 with a 60mm lens , same problem at night. getting light on target

IPC-HFW5241E-Z12E - Dahua International

IPC-HFW5241E-Z12E

www.dahuasecurity.com

Triplesight example
The mailboxes are at about 350ft
*No digital zoom used.







View attachment 192.168.1.110_ch14_20260220141640_20260220141650.mp4

 

[JPmedia]

In my opinion, the closer the camera is to the target, the better the chance of getting a good identifiable image, especially at night. Not sure if mounting a camera near the road is an option or not, but that would be the ideal installation. A bullet or PTZ camera will have a better chance of lighting up the target because of the amount of IR they emit.

 

[oldspyguy]

Yeah a Reolink will never give you that.

The distance isn't a challenge. It is all the trees that will make it tough to get a clean image at night as they will absorb and bounce around most of the IR.

But for a clear daytime you need the 52IR-Z12E or a real PTZ not a toy Reolink.

EmpireTech IPC-B52IR-Z12E-S2 1/2.8" CMOS 2MP 5mm–60mm Ultra Low Light

2MP 1/2.8" CMOS image sensor Built-in IR LED, the max. illumination distance is 150 m Deep learning algorithm Built-in MIC IP67 and IK10 protection SMD 3.0

empiretech01.com

EmpireTech PTZ5A4M-25X 1/1.8" CMOS 4MP 25x Starlight IR 5.4mm–135mm Va

4MP, 1/1.8" CMOS Powerful 25x optical zoom Starlight+ Technology Max. 25/30fps@4MP IR distance up to 150 m Deep-learning-based perimeter protection Auto-tracking and IVS PoE+ IP67, IK10

empiretech01.com

Thanks for the suggestion.
The B521 looks interesting. Only 2mp but big lens. Would like to stay with 4mp or more if possible.
As for IR, I usually disable IR on cameras and use area illuminators or security lighting where possible. Eliminates spider webs, flying bugs, rain and snow at night, and seems to have an impact on longevity due to less heat in my experience but that might be just in my head lol.
Also these cameras are covert in nature so with the IR off someone cant quickly locate them at night with an IR filter on their phone camera. They stand out like artificial suns.
I have a streetlight being installed by the power company to light the end of the driveway and mailbox under the guise of helping firetrucks find my driveway to the dry hydrant in my 4 acre pond.

 

[JPmedia]

Thanks for the suggestion.
The B521 looks interesting. Only 2mp but big lens. Would like to stay with 4mp or more if possible.
As for IR, I usually disable IR on cameras and use area illuminators or security lighting where possible. Eliminates spider webs, flying bugs, rain and snow at night, and seems to have an impact on longevity due to less heat in my experience but that might be just in my head lol.
Also these cameras are covert in nature so with the IR off someone cant quickly locate them at night with an IR filter on their phone camera. They stand out like artificial suns.
I have a streetlight being installed by the power company to light the end of the driveway and mailbox under the guise of helping firetrucks find my driveway to the dry hydrant in my 4 acre pond.

Attached is a photo or two from one of my B52IR-Z12E 2mp cameras. One is at 155 feet and the other is at close to 170 feet. Zoom is pretty much maxed out. I would guestimate that at 300 feet, the images will be close to half the size

 

[oldspyguy]

One option might be the Triplesight

IPC-MFW5241T2-E3-ASE - Dahua International

IPC-MFW5241T2-E3-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Dahua IPC Perimeter Protection Camera - Dahua International

Dahua IPC Perimeter Protection Camera

www.dahuasecurity.com

3 views in one.
Channel 1: 3.6 mm
Channel 2: 12 mm
Channel 3: 25 mm

The downside:

• Daytime, fine. But like any camera you'll need light at the target at night. 300ft is a long way for IR without moving up to a PTZ
• Its only 2MP so not high res as we think of it today

Otherwise, the 5442 Z-12 with a 60mm lens , same problem at night. getting light on target

IPC-HFW5241E-Z12E - Dahua International

IPC-HFW5241E-Z12E

www.dahuasecurity.com

Triplesight example
The mailboxes are at about 350ft
*No digital zoom used.

View attachment 238547

View attachment 238546 View attachment 238545 View attachment 238544



View attachment 238543

Wow, that triple sight looks great for 2mp. I guess a good quality 2mp sensor is better than a crap 5mp sensor any day. Looks like the onboard AI and triggers are robust as well. My eyes are opening lol
Thanks...

 

[wittaj]

Yeah, to get the focal length you need, it is either that 2MP or the 2MP triple cam Bigredfish suggested or you are going to a PTZ. A 4MP (Z4E) on the ideal sensor size (1/1.8") caps out at about half the focal length of the Z12E and at 300 feet, The 2MP Z12E will beat the 4MP Z4E all day long.

In fact, people using the 2MP Z12E at 70ish feet bought a 4MP Z4E for the same spot as a "better" replacement and ended up going back to the 2MP Z12E. Focal length is important.

Since you are kinda new here, I am posting a thread I created showing that the appropriate focal length for the distance needed is far better than a higher MP camera with less focal length. Plenty of examples within that thread demonstrating this.

Digital zoom only works in the movies and TV.

A 2MP camera with the focal length for the distance in question will beat a higher MP with lessor focal length all day long.

Thread 'The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection'

Mar 28, 2022

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP).

I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a forum favorite here @EMPIRETECANDY , but this post will put it all in one place where we can point a NOOB to. The cameras I am highlighting were purchased from @EMPIRETECANDY

Almost every big box store, consumer grade cameras and all-in-one-box kits come with either 2.8mm or 3.6mm...

• wittaj
• Replies: 138
• Forum: Pics & Videos

• 
• 

 

[oldspyguy]

Yeah, to get the focal length you need, it is either that 2MP or the 2MP triple cam Bigredfish suggested or you are going to a PTZ. A 4MP (Z4E) on the ideal sensor size (1/1.8") caps out at about half the focal length of the Z12E and at 300 feet, The 2MP Z12E will beat the 4MP Z4E all day long.

In fact, people using the 2MP Z12E at 70ish feet bought a 4MP Z4E for the same spot as a "better" replacement and ended up going back to the 2MP Z12E. Focal length is important.

Since you are kinda new here, I am posting a thread I created showing that the appropriate focal length for the distance needed is far better than a higher MP camera with less focal length. Plenty of examples within that thread demonstrating this.

Digital zoom only works in the movies and TV.

A 2MP camera with the focal length for the distance in question will beat a higher MP with lessor focal length all day long.

Thread 'The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection'

Mar 28, 2022

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP).

I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a forum favorite here @EMPIRETECANDY , but this post will put it all in one place where we can point a NOOB to. The cameras I am highlighting were purchased from @EMPIRETECANDY

Almost every big box store, consumer grade cameras and all-in-one-box kits come with either 2.8mm or 3.6mm...

• wittaj
• Replies: 138
• Forum: Pics & Videos

• 
• 

Thank you!
I knew I was missing something in the matrix, I was wondering why all the high end Hikvision cams seem to be 4mp.
Glad I joined up.
You only know what you know
Thank you.....

 

[oldspyguy]

Yeah, to get the focal length you need, it is either that 2MP or the 2MP triple cam Bigredfish suggested or you are going to a PTZ. A 4MP (Z4E) on the ideal sensor size (1/1.8") caps out at about half the focal length of the Z12E and at 300 feet, The 2MP Z12E will beat the 4MP Z4E all day long.

In fact, people using the 2MP Z12E at 70ish feet bought a 4MP Z4E for the same spot as a "better" replacement and ended up going back to the 2MP Z12E. Focal length is important.

Since you are kinda new here, I am posting a thread I created showing that the appropriate focal length for the distance needed is far better than a higher MP camera with less focal length. Plenty of examples within that thread demonstrating this.

Digital zoom only works in the movies and TV.

A 2MP camera with the focal length for the distance in question will beat a higher MP with lessor focal length all day long.

Thread 'The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection'

Mar 28, 2022

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP).

I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a forum favorite here @EMPIRETECANDY , but this post will put it all in one place where we can point a NOOB to. The cameras I am highlighting were purchased from @EMPIRETECANDY

Almost every big box store, consumer grade cameras and all-in-one-box kits come with either 2.8mm or 3.6mm...

• wittaj
• Replies: 138
• Forum: Pics & Videos

• 
• 

Just ordered a EmpireTech Z12E S2
Thank you....

 

[looney2ns]

You will see a huge improvement over the Reolink garbage with that Z12ES2
Except for their Door Bell cam, Reolink should be avoided like the plague.

 

[samplenhold]

These captures may help you some. These are from my LPR East cam which is an older 5241EP-Z12E which I installed in 2020. This is NOT the latest, version S2, that is available now.

These caps are from today at about 4pm with good daylight, as you can see the shadows. So about the best lighting conditions I have. The optical zoom is set at about 52mm. So not fully zoomed. The focus is set for my anticipated capture point of 110 feet. I have included three pics. One is the car at 110 feet in my normal capture zone. The next one is after it turned the corner and is about 215 feet from the cam. Remember that the focus is set for 110 feet and this shows the plate is at quite a high angle, very foreshortened. The third pic is a capture of just the car at 215 feet but at the 100% zoom of the photo. You can play with the digital zoom to see how the 2MP cam pixelates the view from digital zoom.

This is at 110 feet 52mm. My set capture distance.


This is the same car after it turned the corner and is about 215 feet away.



This last one is the same picture as the one above but has been screen grabbed and is at 100% zoom. So no digital zoom applied.



You can see that maybe if the camera optical zoom was at 60mm and the plate was head on, not at an angle, and the focus was set for that distance, one could probably read the plate. Certainly, can get some descriptions of the car like color, make, damage to back, etc.

I do not have any captures after dark at that distance since the angle of the plate will not reflect back to the camera.

EDIT: I thought you would be able to click on the photo and expand the digital zoom. I guess you can download it to play with the digital zoom.

 

[oldspyguy]

You will see a huge improvement over the Reolink garbage with that Z12ES2
Except for their Door Bell cam, Reolink should be avoided like the plague.

Yup, I was upgrading from a 24 cam AHD system to IP and got suckered in by the half way good person/vehicle detection and alerts. Before I realized the quality issues I had 2 – duo4k, 5 – E1 outdoor 5mp, 3 – 420 5mp, 2 – 510 wa, and 2 – 811A. Uggh
Its not a total loss yet, I will probably use some of them just for perimeter alerts and use real cameras for close in identification purposes for now.
Should have came here sooner lol

 

[oldspyguy]

Recieved my EmpireTech Z12E S2 and am impressed with the image clarity right out of the box. Its nice to see detail without motion blur like my other crap cams.
Thanks for the suggestions.